Mac O'Grady top ballstriker? Annikan and others thoughts?
 

I have read several times that Mac O'Grady is considered one of the best ballstrikers of all time. His swing is a thing of beauty, but the statistics on the pgatour.com website do not correlate with the type of ballstriker people have made him out to be. His greens in regulation statistic is quite average on tour. I invite anyone to check it out. While I don't consider this to be the end all-be all of this topic, I am just wondering what knowledgeable people would say in response to this. I am truly not trying to be disrespectful.

Matt

I think it would be helpful to define the term "ballstriker".

I'm sure Mac can compress the ball with the best of them. I have heard first hand about his exploits in 2 iron flop shots and other tricks. But is that all there is to ballstriking? I hope not, otherwise some will never make it off the range.

Bagger

Point well taken. I define a top ballstriker as one that has an extraordinary command of the golf ball, both distance and accuracy.

I have yet to meet Mac, but it is something I plan to do because those who have talk about it as one of those unforgettable golf experiences.

From what I have been told the sound that you hear off Mac's clubhead is undeniable. Mac is one of the best at transfering the energy of his swing to the golf ball, and he can tell you why he's one of the best, and then he can do it left handed with a Taylor Made rescue club turned upside down or whatever you like.

So the measure is not on greens although trust me the tour stats don't do him justice. Instead it's on the quality of his motion and impact.

Sorting Through the Circuit Player's Handbook.

B-Ray

The longest walk
 

With that definition, he may be the best in the world. He understands the geometry of the swing and has taken that into his own realm. He also applies his knowledge (demonstrates)to an exceptional degree. I'm just not convinced that when you take him out of his comfort zone and into competition, that the ballstriking ability holds up.

I don't know Mac, have never met him, my opinion is based on the first hand accounts from people who have.

I always feel like I am raining on a parade....

A dear friend and student of mine, Tommy Moore, who also worked a bunch with Rob Noel, and who passed away in his late 30's a few years back, played with Mac in a US OPEN qualifier during the period of time I was teaching Tommy.

He was totally unimpressed by his ballstriking, and at this time, I hailed Mac as "one of the all-time best ball strikers."

Tommy knew the difference, and although one round is no way to measure such a thing, it said a lot to me. I looked into the stats and saw the same thing as mrodock.

Just in case you think that Tommy was never impressed, it should be noted that he was EVRY impressed by Tom Bartlett, GSEB, who is—like another New Orleanian Stan Stopa—one of the very best ball-strikers EVER who hasn't carried a PGA Tour card.

Not raining, just tellin' it like it is...
 

Well, the guy (Mac)keeps trying to qualify here, there, and everywhere, and doesn't. I guess SOMETHING is missing...

Well.....I try not to base my facts on others opinions of someone...Yes...I've seen him first hand....NOT through someone elses's bias...my own bias....I've seen Tiger,Phil, and O'Meara, Faldo.,etc........worked with Branshaw,Clearwater, and Lancaster....


Never saw Hogan..met Snead...or Trevino...

Know a guy that kicked Johny Miller's ass day in and day out at BYU..used to teach him....10 time...Mike Taylor

Yeah...Mac used to be the best during his era...80's....

And He has more Command of your swing than you do...and has command over his gozillion models....


But what matters ain't that at all...It's about going Low...as pretty or as ugly as it needs to be!!!!


He used to go low...but has since lost that "instinct"!!!

People that haven't seen, worked, learned from him first hand really can't have an educated opinion here... heresay is just a bunch of crap...

I have....

Annikan, you are right. I am wrong. Sorry.

I have seen him first hand a few times and his ball striking is a different league, his clinics are also awesome with the club the right way round or turned upside down using a left handed swing.

I will certainly defer to your expertise. We all know you have worked with him.

I think the only true assessment of Mac's ball-striking capabilities would come from the touring pros who saw him play day in, day out. Certainly, someone's evaluation based on a single round in a US qualifier doesn't mean much. Even the best ball-strikers have off days.

Bruce

Refer to Annikans post as the definitive post in this thread, as I have not yet met Mac, mine is useless.

Sorting Through the Duffer's Bible.

B-Ray

Tommy Moore was one of THE most knowledgeable golfers who could play, of all-time. He PLAYED the PGA TOUR, for over 5 years, won on the Nike Tour, etc. etc.

You would have to know Tommy and Rob could probably tell you millions of Tommy stories. So could Tom Bartlett, a great friend of his.

I have no opinion on his ball-striking anymore. I am sure he can hit it very well. I have seen him in person well prior to Tommy's round in Minn., and thought he was very impressive.

But what do I know?

This is a long time ago ...but back in 91'or 92' when I was fresh out of college I was chasing the Monday qulaifiers of the Ben Hogan Tour...I got in Brierwood CC in Hamburg, NY I think I remember seeing the name Tommy Moore and if my memory serves me right(It may have bee elsewhere) ..Is he a LSU boy?...If yes...very good action if it's the same dude i think it is....I played with JC Anderson and Jeff Gallagher in te first 2 rounds after a MC.....JC....That dude was a real hoot...TGM too....We're standing on the green of a Par 5 on the back and someone went into a porta -john back up around the 150 yd marker just when JC's getting ready to putt...JC stops waits til the guy comes out...and yells "Are you Finished?"....Man the things we come up with when things aren't going our way..

Brian ...there is no need to apologize...you have every right to your opinion...due to your level of expertise......I just have a problem with people who bash ohters who don't have your level of expertise or have no personal account of the subject matter...

I have a lot of respect for Mac's ability, intellect, hard work....but that's about as far as it goes...I'm no longer inside the circle, (It was more like the circumference...LOL)...have no desire to be either....I get ton's of PM's concerning Mac and it is very flattering indeed..but it's not like I have this secret code to MORAD...I took a lot of notes ...Stayed with him at Sea Island...went to Palm Springs and Orlando...Watched him play at the CVS Charity and the BC Open when he played either a group ahead or behind Clearwater....took some very personal footage of him teaching not only myself...but my wife....I don't know why people would want that stuff unless they want to gawk over my beautiful wife who happens to have a better motion and figure than myself!!!!

He's a great talent...

so what's the big deal...

so we acknowledge that move on...

Annikan wrote: Brian ...there is no need to apologize...you have every right to your opinion...due to your level of expertise......I just have a problem with people who bash ohters who don't have your level of expertise or have no personal account of the subject matter..



My post wasn't meant to be a bash. I was just commenting, as the original poster, that the results aren't comparable with the attributes. You say, "he lost the instinct." I'll buy that. That would certainly be an intangible that could make the difference between shooting a 73 and a 68.

I apologize if you took my post to be a bash.

No, he didn't go to LSU. Tommy Moore went to Oklahoma State (ranked #1 in country as a junior). He was there with Tway, Verplank, Pfister, etc. His nickname was Doc. In 1991 he was full time on PGA Tour.

Maybe the greatest short game of all time.

Thanks for the correction on Tommy Moore...I do recognize the name...just mistaken identity on my part....What happend to his game and what does he do now?

Tommy died of a rare blood disease in 1998 ( I was told there have only been something like 9 known cases). He was 34 years old.

Sorry to hear that...pray he knew the Lord...


Now you 've got me thinkng......Who am I thinking about from LSU?...Not David Toms....but wasn't there a dude from Louisiana that was really good..I thought it was a Tommy__________?

LSU-PLAYERS-CHRONOLOGICALLY

Wayne DeFrancesco
Rob McNamara
Charlie Raulerson
Bob Friend
Doug Barron
Emlyn Aubrey
Tommy Mudd
David Toms
Greg Lesher
Fred Lindgren
Mike Finney
Perry Moss
Tom Bartlett
Jason Larson
Scott Sterling
Brian Bateman
D.A. Points

If he was from LSU he should be in this list somewhere.

Now that I know your name is David Orr it sounds really familiar. Did we ever play together?

Don't forget Lafayette's own Jay Hebert. Hebert led the LSU Tigers to the 1947 NCAA College Golf Championships. He also won the 1960 PGA Championship at Firestone.:smile:

Tommy Mudd.....thanks

I played with Charlie Raulerson in a Nike Monday qualifier in Haines City, Fla...

Played in events or chased mini-tours with a lot of the dudes...listed....Geez LSU has put out a bunch of "bayou bengals" on the Professional circuits...

Tom what tours did you play on?

Perhaps we've run into each other on the road, range, played infront of or behind....I chased it for a while in the early and mid 90's...I made more money teaching than playing..thus this is where I am today!!!!!

Played PGA Q-Schools, PGA Monday qualifiers, Hogan, Nike, Buy.com, Nationwide qualifiers, U.S. Opens, State Opens, Hooters tour, Ninfa's tour, Texas tour, Lone Star tour, Tight Lies tour, Gulf Coast tour, Emerald Coast tour and several other independent tournaments too many to list.

Last serious shot was a few years back. I decided to Monday qualify only, for the year. I told a friend of mine who was going to caddy for me if we shoot 69 every week we will get into 90% of the tournaments. I played in six in a row. 69,69,70,67,69,69 didn't get into a single one. The 67 I believe to be the lowest score shot in a U.S. Open first stage not to make it. It was at the course where Rob Noel teaches and there were 3 66's, my 67 then I believe a 71. Anyway, Tommy Moore had always told me not to go the "Monday" route it will only dishearten you...should have listened.

But David, I am almost positive that I remember your name. As attested above, I spent a lot of time in front of score boards watching everything go to crap. lol

Me too.....and yes the Monday route is very disheartening....but in a way it was cool...and cruel...Tommy thanks for your correspondence...The chase on the mini-tours was cool too...My favorite was the summer chase of the North Atlantic Tour.....The New Hampshire Open in Keene...and of course the infamous Bangor Open in Maine....Just a small mini-tour stop for us..but to the folks up there..it was the closest thing to the real thing...they always treated us well...I'll never forget Chris Demarco playing in Keene a few groups ahead of us at Bretwood CC....You never know what dudes will make it big..but it's cool to know you've played with or in the same events as the guys that are making it big today....


And yeah..how many times have we all said "If only....."

My college teammate David Branshaw made it to the big time after 12 years chasing the mini tours...it takes a lotta $ and time to really learn how to get it done, when you're not quite as talented as Tiger, wealthy as Hal Sutton, and an attitude like Fulton Allem.....

But I learned a boat load form those experiences and from guys like Mac O'Grady....

As far as TGM....Lynn and this site got it goin on!!!

Uh huh. Huh.

Perv...Bangor!!!:D

Mac O'Grady
 

Having had the privilege to attend two of Mac's seminar's gave me an insight into his knowledge and love of the game and Homer Kelley. I told him he was a credit to the game and he appreciated it very much and I have that on tape. I enjoyed the clarity of his message and his desire to make sure you came away with a lot of information. I hope to attend another seminar in the future.

Leozevo is wise beyond his years...what cool dude as well...Always a willing learner and student of this game!!!!;)

How does one find out about a Mac O'Grady seminar???

DG

My good friend Tong.....


I've been waiting....and waiting..and waiting...and waiting....

I bet it won't be soon!!!


So until then......


Let's continue havin fun!!!


Here at LBG

I read an article from 1993 where he was saying the same thing. At the time, he had 3 books ready to publish for the following year. They never did come out.

I don't know much about MORAD....

I think Homer always said that he always felt like he was no more than a week away from finishing his study.

ANYTIME anyones's in New Hampshire it's memorable.....period

Ball Striker
 

A friend of mine played with Jodie Mudd a few years ago, and yes, he still plays golf occasionally I believe. Jodie was a pretty fair ball striker himself. A similar question came up. Jodie said that Mac was the best out there, and could do it left, or right handed.

I believe they are talking about solidly hit, compressed balls. The sound of the strike, the ball speed, the ability to shape shots, and things like that.

I saw Mike Bennett, for example, hitting balls a few months ago. People were gathering around just to watch him on the range, and a tour player was near by, but they were mainly watching Mike. The sound of the ball being struck, the ball speed, and the quality of his shots stood out from the ordinary. This was when most people did not know who he was, but they could tell that something was quite different about the quality of his strikes.

I believe this is what they are talking about, in terms of ball striking. One would think that this type of thing would translate into good scores, and it sometimes does. Ben Hogan, was one of the best ball strikers, by this definition, and could also score quite well. Those that do not... there are many possible reasons... short game, mental aspects, management, etc..