Thanks HB,
What I think I am trying to say is that, My swing on the range is much better than the swing I take to the course. If my handicap was based on the way I hit the ball on the range I might be a 2 or 3. For some reason my ball striking drops off once I start playing. My putting is the strongest part of my game, I almost always make alot of putts, sadly they are rarely for birdie. I play spurts of great golf, but I can never keep it going. Usually not even for nine holes. Just the other day I was 5 under after 7 holes and barely broke 80 for the round.
8cork,
Thanks for getting involved with this. I'm not trying to give you a hard time, regardless of how it might sound (Bucket, on the other hand, may get some grief). You did not answer my questions, but you did shed some light. I'll comment on your post and ask the questions again.
Except for the "Gamer," everyone hits it better on the range. Do you hit it better on range because you hit the same club over and over at the same target? Do you make little adjustments between shots to improve result? Do you feel more relaxed because you can just drag another one over? Are you more comfortable because you know where it will land? Better because you aren't keeping score? I'm not making assessments or recommendations yet, I need more info. Describe your practice routine.
As for spurts of great golf. Excellent, it shows you have the ability. Take heart. Top level golf is allowing those streaks to happen and managing the rest of the round for the lowest score. What causes these runs to stop? Do you keep score in your head or notice your relationship to par while you play? Do you hit a bad shot and try to figure out the cause instead of wiping it from memory? Do you get nervous / excited when you get it going? Do you start thinking about telling your buddies about your great round?
Do you get overconfident and try shots beyond your ability or aim at pins you should not. Do you fail to get up and down from a relatively easy spot? Again, I'm not saying you should or should not do any of these things. I'm merely describing some things people do to interrupt great scoring rounds. When you say you act different on the range and the course, is that more a description of the results or the process?
First . . . Question: A lot of times I'm just trying to "hit it there" basically a straight shot. Should I instead of thinking "hit it there" think hit a draw there? I think right to left is more of my natural curve. But I can go both ways (don't do it Mike O!).
SHORT GAME
Short chip shots are my strength. I'm pretty decent at hitting sandwedge chips to about 40 feet out.
If I have to hit longer chips I typically have more trouble with distance control. I'd say my error is typically long.
I can hit low wedges with some check pretty good
High wedges are more of a problem for me. I don't do well with flops. I'm a low spinner type.
I hit down on chips and pitches maybe too steep.
40-50 yard shots are tougher for me particularly if they have to carry something . . . come in too low and hot.
I typically chip with sw, gap and 9 . . . I used to carry lob but no mo'. 48, 52, 56.
I'm better at hitting shots hard than soft.
I'm more snappy than sweepy.
How's that?
Bucket,
More good info. I think "hit it there" is correct as long as you choose your target based on your pattern. In fact, YES. Pick the smallest target you can. Use your imagination to see the flight.
OK, we now have another hole in your game to improve. The trouble with the low spinner (my fav. as well) is that it can be difficult to adjust to changing conditions. The spinner can react with a large variance based on the green condition (firmness, speed, grain, etc). You don't have to abandon your favorite shot, but you do need to learn another basic one. This shot should be softer with less spin, using trajectory to control roll. The method also uses the landing spot as the target, rather than the whole shot. The idea being, if you can control trajectory and landing spot, your short game will be more able to conform to the variety of conditions. You will be more able to take it on the road.
HB
Tell me about your putting. Include your assessment of your abilty under pressure. How do you read greens? Describe philosophy.
I don't think I want to take on the whole forum membership. Lets add you in here and try to create a sort of FAQ. If we can answer enough questions for a few particular guys, then we could cover most of the points. As other questions arise, we could answer those without doing a complete analysis.
More good info. I think "hit it there" is correct as long as you choose your target based on your pattern. In fact, YES. Pick the smallest target you can. Use your imagination to see the flight.
OK, we now have another hole in your game to improve. The trouble with the low spinner (my fav. as well) is that it can be difficult to adjust to changing conditions. The spinner can react with a large variance based on the green condition (firmness, speed, grain, etc). You don't have to abandon your favorite shot, but you do need to learn another basic one. This shot should be softer with less spin, using trajectory to control roll. The method also uses the landing spot as the target, rather than the whole shot. The idea being, if you can control trajectory and landing spot, your short game will be more able to conform to the variety of conditions. You will be more able to take it on the road.
HB
Tell me about your putting. Include your assessment of your abilty under pressure. How do you read greens? Describe philosophy.
hmmmmmm . . . my Putting . . . well in a word . . . SUX!!!
I have streaks where I can putt well. And I make a bunch of putts . . . but then . . . it goes south . . . WAY south.
PUTTING
I'm a pretty good reader of greens. I pick a high spot and try to roll it there and have it dying there.
From 12 to 20 feet I can putt . . . but from 8 to 3 . . . I may as well let Stevie Wonder take a stab at it.
When I miss the short ones . . . I miss the whole freakin' hole.
Last round of golf . . . I hit 12 greens knock it on 2 par 5's and am pin high on another. . . 3 jack 6 times . . . make NO putts (none zero nada) over 3 feet and shoot 81.
I'm pretty much feel based. When I'm on I can really putt but . . . but when the feel is gone hello Helen Keller.
I have problems trusting my alignment.
My distance control outside of 20 feet is doo doo.
Actually under pressure I putt a little better on the long ones but the short ones give me fits.
As you can see I'm oooooozing with confidence with the putter.
__________________
Aloha Mr. Hand
Behold my hands; reach hither thy hand
Last edited by 12 piece bucket : 07-11-2007 at 09:08 PM.
hmmmmmm . . . my Putting . . . well in a word . . . SUX!!!
I have streaks where I can putt well. And I make a bunch of putts . . . but then . . . it goes south . . . WAY south.
PUTTING
I'm a pretty good reader of greens. I pick a high spot and try to roll it there and have it dying there.
From 12 to 20 feet I can putt . . . but from 8 to 3 . . . I may as well let Stevie Wonder take a stab at it.
When I miss the short ones . . . I miss the whole freakin' hole.
Last round of golf . . . I hit 12 greens knock it on 2 par 5's and am pin high on another. . . 3 jack 6 times . . . make NO putts (none zero nada) over 3 feet and shoot 81.
I'm pretty much feel based. When I'm on I can really putt but . . . but when the feel is gone hello Helen Keller.
I have problems trusting my alignment.
My distance control outside of 20 feet is doo doo.
Actually under pressure I putt a little better on the long ones but the short ones give me fits.
As you can see I'm oooooozing with confidence with the putter.
Bucket,
Wow. We have found a real hotspot. If we can get your putting back to average, we are halfway home. You will have to do some mechanical work. We need to find out what makes you miss from short range. Face is huge in terms of short putting. Distance control is about hitting it solid enough to get accurate feedback. My recommendation is to get on a chalk line and have someone watch the path. I like a gentle arc. If you can have an expert check the aim, better. Do you change putters? Did you ever putt alot better and changed trying to improve? What style of putter? Miss everywhere or left or right, short or long.
Mental side. Are you severly damaged? I mean -- is it so bad you can't even picture a putt go in during visualization. No, you can't be that far gone, you said you are streaky. The fact that you putt some putts better under pressure is good.
How many putts a round do you try to wish in? On a six footer that reads just outside left edge, what are you thinking. Do you get really committed. Are you standing over the putt wondering about your alignment? Or is it after you have missed. Describe in detail your preshot.
Here's mine. I read putt from behind. Classic low position with sun blocked by hands on side of head. I'm looking to see the high side. I may look from low side (more likely on longer putt). Sometimes stand beside the line close to the hole like Bones. I'm always looking for something that says this way rather than conflicting views (One reason I don't often look from other side). Then I DECIDE. Now I picture the whole arc, and where I want the ball to roll into the hole. Say seven O'clock. I stand tall behind the ball and a few steps away. Twirl my putter as I walk crisply toward the ball. Shake my left arm a little (maybe Tiger does this). Set up. Two practice stokes while I look exactly where I want the ball to enter the hole. Then I bend my neck so I'm looking staight down on top of the ball and let it go.... Sounds like a lot reading it back. There's no room for anything wish-washy. I decide before I move towards the ball. No checking of mechanics. I have to feel crisp but leisurely. I act like I know what I'm doing.
Lesson number one. Never again give such an honest account of your putting. More than any other aspect of the game, what you think and say about your putting will come true. I'm not going to ask you to stand in front of the mirror and do affirmations (not a bad idea--and I might have you do this later based on progress), but we need to be more positive.
The worst thing I want you to say about your putting from now on is, "I'm putting good, but I'm not making as many as I would like." You are free to be more positive.
Answer the questions in here before you get more.
HB
Last edited by Hennybogan : 07-11-2007 at 11:11 PM.
dang this is good stuff...i think youve answered about 10 questions i may have just by helpin out the chicken wing bucket. lol! i'm a silent spectator in this thread but boy am i into it. Great to have ya henny
Thanks for getting involved with this. I'm not trying to give you a hard time, regardless of how it might sound (Bucket, on the other hand, may get some grief). You did not answer my questions, but you did shed some light. I'll comment on your post and ask the questions again.
Except for the "Gamer," everyone hits it better on the range. Do you hit it better on range because you hit the same club over and over at the same target? Do you make little adjustments between shots to improve result? Do you feel more relaxed because you can just drag another one over? Are you more comfortable because you know where it will land? Better because you aren't keeping score? I'm not making assessments or recommendations yet, I need more info. Describe your practice routine.
As for spurts of great golf. Excellent, it shows you have the ability. Take heart. Top level golf is allowing those streaks to happen and managing the rest of the round for the lowest score. What causes these runs to stop? Do you keep score in your head or notice your relationship to par while you play? Do you hit a bad shot and try to figure out the cause instead of wiping it from memory? Do you get nervous / excited when you get it going? Do you start thinking about telling your buddies about your great round?
Do you get overconfident and try shots beyond your ability or aim at pins you should not. Do you fail to get up and down from a relatively easy spot? Again, I'm not saying you should or should not do any of these things. I'm merely describing some things people do to interrupt great scoring rounds. When you say you act different on the range and the course, is that more a description of the results or the process?
HB
I am not really certain why I hit it better on the range. I usually go through a large and small bucket of balls starting with my wedges and moving through the bag. Usually hit 10 to 12 drivers and then finish off with my wedges. Because of past swing flaws, (overplane) I really concentrate on hitting the inside quadrant of the ball and driving out to right field. I hit nice soft draws with the occasional pull thrown in. I can go through 100 balls on the range and never hit a hook. But, when I play its fore left!! On a typical round I may hook 10 out of 14 tee shots, 2 or 3 of those will be completely off the golf course. I play like Seve, always scrambling, getting up and down from everywhere, making 4 or 5 par putts per round between 6 and 10 feet. It's truely madness, drives me stir crazy. Generally in a round I may have only about 4 two putt pars. I play high stress golf.
I am a very mechanical player, always trying to fix my swing on the course. I think I need to become more of a feel player. Also, I have a completely different tempo on the course. I can feel my swing getting shorter and faster as I play.
Bucket, when we get together for a round, maybe we should play captains choice.
I am not really certain why I hit it better on the range. I usually go through a large and small bucket of balls starting with my wedges and moving through the bag. Usually hit 10 to 12 drivers and then finish off with my wedges. Because of past swing flaws, (overplane) I really concentrate on hitting the inside quadrant of the ball and driving out to right field. I hit nice soft draws with the occasional pull thrown in. I can go through 100 balls on the range and never hit a hook. But, when I play its fore left!! On a typical round I may hook 10 out of 14 tee shots, 2 or 3 of those will be completely off the golf course. I play like Seve, always scrambling, getting up and down from everywhere, making 4 or 5 par putts per round between 6 and 10 feet. It's truely madness, drives me stir crazy. Generally in a round I may have only about 4 two putt pars. I play high stress golf.
I am a very mechanical player, always trying to fix my swing on the course. I think I need to become more of a feel player. Also, I have a completely different tempo on the course. I can feel my swing getting shorter and faster as I play.
Bucket, when we get together for a round, maybe we should play captains choice.
8cork,
It sounds, on one hand, like you don't need my advice. It sounds like you get the most out of your ballstriking.
Maybe I can help. I always knew that I was not the calm, causual type. I swing more like Nick Price than Bob Murphy. So my goal was always to build a swing that would work at that speed. I'm more relaxed than I was early on, but I'm still on the quick side. When I practice, contary to some common advice, I try to get my swing ramped up to on course speed. I think you want to swing at a pace that fits your personality.
Trying to fix your swing on the course just does not work, as a rule. If you are mechanical on the course, it can interrupt the flow of your swing and cause steering and other problems. You might have one tendency you can think of and have a few practice swings with some special feel before you start your routine. Once you walk in, if you take practice swings, they should be directed towards the shot at hand and not away from the current miss.
If you are more calm and casual in normal life, you need to look at what causes you to speed up. Are you clear about what causes the left shots? Can you take some video while you play and compare it to the range? Have you taken the whole bottle of pills with regard to being overplane? Understanding the cause of your left shots may go a long way towards solving your problem with getting it to the course.
dang this is good stuff...i think youve answered about 10 questions i may have just by helpin out the chicken wing bucket. lol! i'm a silent spectator in this thread but boy am i into it. Great to have ya henny
Powerdraw,
Thanks. Bucket and I were going to do this in PM, but we decided it would serve the forum better in public. Hope you enjoy.
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